Post Holy Spirit???

Ok, dave has an excellent article that resonates with what I have been saying about the whole postmodern deal. Go read it, come back here and let's try to answer some of these questions that he poses...

Can we work in a context of no absolute truth, when we consider the fact that we as Christians believe that Jesus is the truth?

Are we accepting that postmodernism is thoroughly inevitable, and if so is it really?

Is the fact that postmodern thought seems to run so counter to the teachings of Jesus a sign that the church has been too weak in presenting the message of God's love, and if so is the answer to strengthen our message, in word and deed?

Does meeting people where they are mean we have to accept things as they are?

Are we going in the wrong direction by assuming that we have to reframe the truth of the Gospel to reach a worldview that rejects absolute truth? Is the Gospel powerful enough to overcome people's preconceptions. It was in my case.

What are we going to do? Truth is still truth. Jesus is still the way the truth and the life, right?

And my own questions would be... Where is the Holy Spirit. And I don't mean that as a precursor to say that those attempting to reach the PMers are wrong and I am right. I am trying to reach a PM group of kids too... but what I mean is this: are we shaping the Gospel to reach the PMers or are we allowing the Gospel to reach the PMers and expecting the Holy Spirit to change THEM!

Christ's gospel is one that changes, it transforms, it happens slowly sometimes and quickly others, it is ongoing, it is constant... so is it more revealing that those PM MINISTERS are more *postmodern* than the people they are ministering too??? I mean does this reveal our growing up in a culture that sees everyone as needing help and not being able to meet their own needs so the "establishment" has to step into to meet it? Or more spiritually-pointed... as needing Jesus, but not expecting the Gospel/Christ/Holy Spirit to stand on their own merit and volition??? Is ANYTHING inevitable that God has not told us will happen. I mean we know that a physical resurrection is inevitable... God told us about it. We know a great falling away is inevitable... God told us about it.

But sometimes I get the impression from the Postmoderns that if I preach the gospel as is that I am shooting a gun with blanks or at best suctions darts. That the Word of God isn't enough. But is it really what I do... or how palatable I make the gospel that reaches out to people??? Does God need me and the Postmoderns to reach this generation? Or do I need God?

I always found it amazing that Dr. Livingstone... this distant, white, missionary was able to go to Africa and reach people for Christ. People he had nothing (including language) in common with... but the Spirit overcame the obstacles in spite of who Livingstone was. All because he went. He was willing.

So pardon me if I skip the candles, I definitely am not going to do some ancient catholic traditional service, I just want to be willing.

Changes

I continually hear about (and believe in) the idea that a true christian should not worry about the facade of Christianity but should attract others to Christ by the changes He made in our lives. I guess I sometimes wonder though, what those changes might look like to the postmodern believer. If we see a change in our dress... well that could be considered legalistic. If we see a change in our language... well that might mean we aren't being "relevant". If we see a change in out contentment and happiness... who else sees that??? I think that the inside change will make outside changes and just wonder how that fits in. I don't buy the cry of "legalistic" when we change outwardly after we have changed inwardly.

The Postmodern thought says why shouldn't I listen to the same music I did??? Talk the same as I did??? Dress the same as I did??? Drink the same as I did??? Watch the same thing I did??? So my question is for those with the penchant of seeing Christ SHINE through in your life... where is it shown if not in these area's. I mean outwardly... because that is what men see. Doesn't an inward change necessitate an outward change. Shouldn't we see things totally different like Paul did. Won't the scales fall from our eyes and a new vision be given to us?

Just wondering what a postmodern Christian looks like??? Is it that they go to church now? or have a community or whatever you want to call it?

Our love has to be verbal, visual, and veritable to be experienced by someone else. You can know you love someone, but if you never tell them, or show them, or make it real to them... how do they know?

Is it because we are kind? What if we were kind before? I don't think there is a timescale or schedule. But if God is really working in the heart when does he work is way out and what does it look like? Should we not want to be identified different than those who aren't saved from hell? Should we not want to be identified different than those who have no personal realtionship with the creator?

We are called salt and light... Because salt is different than unsalted. Light is opposite of dark. Does that mean anything to us?

And where does repentence fall? Does a change of heart = a change of mind = a change of lifestyle??? Should it?

Do you know how many times...

...that I hit reply when I read a blog that is just screaming to be commented on and then hit cancel and think, "why waste the time". People are so predictable. Ok, so I am a person too and that is a self-indictment, but still I just can't believe some of the tripe I read.

The one common theme I can see in alot of the Postmodern hoopla (cool, I said hoopla) is a lack of good bible scholarship. Now to explain that, I don't mean a lack of intelligent philosophy. A lot of these men and ladies are powerful thinkers but to the point of being poor scholars. I get a little bit of a kick out of all these "thinkers" who keep saying "be the church". But again I say to be you have to do.

Did I say that??? To Be You Have To Do!!! Did you get it? Quit rolling in all your philosphy and go do something. Communal relationships... blah, blah, blah... (go clean out the old lady at your churches basement) maybe you will find that community you are looking for without having to throw a tantrum that you have been hurt, abused, battered, {fill in your pain} and go start your own church where everyone feels the same way as you do. Thats not community. That's actually very sectarian.

Community is living with the people that don't like you and making it work. It living with people you don't like and learning to love them, the way Christ did.

So get some candles at home and light them and call yourself postmodern, but find a bible believing (that would mean they believe it IS the truth not just contains the truth) church and go make a community.

To Be You Have To Do... get it?

Decisions Made... good and bad.

My friend Theophilus, suggested that I elaborate on some of the decisions that were made after a recent college trip to Florida. I stated that there were some good decisions made and some bad decisions made. Some by me, some by others. I wish I could write and say I made all the best decisions that I could have made but I didn't.

We have made this trip for 3 years in a row now and each trip I have learned something new. This year was the first year that we had a parent attend the trip with us. I was happy to have her attend... at first. One of the bad decisions I made was to not lay out ALL of the rules that we expected on this trip. I assumed (yeah, don't tell me, I know what that means) that the parent knew our goals of the trip and was there to support myself and the senior pastor as the leaders of the trip. What ended up happening though was that she trumped our leadership because she was "MOM" of 2 of the kids on the trip and it ended up affecting another teen who went down with us.

Here is how the story goes. Every year when we go down we get there Wednesday, attend church on campus, and the students spend the next 2 days/3 nights living the life of a college student. They go to classes, attend chapel, follow the same rules that the students follow that attend. They don't have distractions of going of campus and to the beach etc. because we want them to focus on the messages in chapel and to be somewhat isolated so God can work in His small still voice. The parent that went down and her children, just recently joined the church. They moved here from Cleveland a few years back and attended a big church that is like-minded there. So they know a lot of people from that church. They saw some people who attend the college there that they knew from that church and her kids decided that they wanted to go to the beach. The mom said ok, and no one cleared anything with the SP or me. You may wonder why this is a problem. The problem comes in a few ways. And I am not a control freak that the mom had control of her kids and I didn't, at least not too much of a control freak. But there are a couple facts that caused the whole group problems. The first is that they skipped out of chapel to go to the beach. This was a problem because one of the students of the college (their friend) drove them, and could be booted from the college for doing this. The second problem is that another of the kids from our church went with them. I can only imagine the scenario of him going off campus and not telling us, him drowning in a riptide or something and me having to call his mom and tell her I didn't know where her son was. Thirdly, it added a sense of rebellion to the group. Let's face it, when you come from cold/snowy ohio and hit the Florida sunshine, many would choose the beach over chapel, but that doesn't make it right. Because of that sense of rebellion there were hard feelings from some in the group who did the right thing and those who did the wrong thing.

So my bad decsions were NOT going over in detail with the parent what we expect to accomplish, and just assuming she knew. The other bad decision was (after driving for about 16 hours and being tired/cranky) when I felt that the parent was challenging me on something (something stupid, the discussion was about how much interaction the college kids had with the outside world/media influence and how many would even know who William Hung was, she said "EVERYONE would they aren't as sheltered as you think") I made the remark (fast lips/slow brain) that not everyone sneaks off campus to go the beach... OUCH, not smart. She didn't say much after that, and I did apologize for it later. We chalked it up to both of us being super tired. In truth she was challenging me and in truth I was insulting her. But I should know better. So two stupid decision on my part. Lot's on some students part and a few on a parents part. I live, I learn, next year I will lay it out better for the parents that attend.

As far as good decisions. We had 4 senior who went down who plan on attending this fall. We also had many personal decisions in the chapel services that people made. We went to the church where one of our students who attends the college is the intern Youth Pastor on the last night. He put together a youth rally while we were there so we could attend. It was well done and we got to hear a great song that some of the African students at the college shared with us. This was special because it is the first time I have ever seen my GUYS fired up about a song for Jesus, as a Group I mean. They literally sung the song for 40 minutes on the way home and then they sung it on Sunday Night for the church congregation. It was a trip that I am glad we made... but I always need about a year to recuperate and forget how much I hate the drive down and back.

I guess that is the greatness of God, that he can work through the good and bad decisions to see his will accomplished.

Fundamentalist Compassion???

Do you ever feel like there is a lack of compassion in the Independent Fundamental Baptist Community? I know it is hard to make a generalization of this sort because we are not a denomination, per se, because we don't have a hierarchy outside of the confines of the Biblical model of the local church. Your church may be compassionate, but let's try to look at a bigger picture. I don't like complaint sessions that are useless. Complaints are a valid form of communication if they are used to bring about change or reform but they are a hideous thing when just used as a vehicle for hatred and disdain.

With that said, I want to register my formal complaint against fundamentalism. I am about as fundamental as you can get, down to no mixed swimming, no CCM etc. but I have a terrible problem with some of my fundamental brethern who seem to have transcended their sinful flesh and reached their perfected form on earth.

It seems to me that we have a problem in fundamentalism of shooting our wounded. When we see someone fall into sin or even show doubt for a long held tenet (I dare not say doctrine, because much of what is held by many of the fundamental churches today is tradition as much as the Catholic church or any other "mainline" denomination is.) we tend to want to disassociate with them as quickly as possible. To shun them and set them aside from our fellowship. We call it church discipline and we call it Biblical.

Let me clarify this for a moment, I believe whole heartedly in Church discipline, but I don't really ever see us practice it as the Bible lays it out. We don't because it is hard, it requires us to be completely in the right, whether we are pastors or youth leaders, it means that we have to be right with God and on the complete side of right when we address the persons sin with them personally. It means that we have to find someone who is godly-minded and Christ-centered to go with us to address the individual if they refuse to hear us or repent the first time. If we look at the Biblical model it is hard because it takes a lot of effort.

And that is my point, we as fundamentalist don't want to take the effort to reconcile people to God in our churches. We are content to throw them out to the world or to some other church that may have some false doctrine that they preach. And we slap our hands together and go on our way... but my question is this... Is this compassion? Is this how Christ came to us? Did he say... "Here is your one chance... get saved now because you won't have another"? God is long suffering. He is compassionate. If you were about to lose your spouse, would you just say... oh well, that's what they chose... there are more fish in the see? Why do we let our fellow fundamentalists struggle and slip away the same way.

If we are honest with ourselves I think we would find it is easier to do that and have someone that agree's with us 100% than to fight for the faith and have to stand on what we believe.

I am not writing this because of my personal struggle with fundamentalism. I am writing this because I have read too many testimonies of people who were saved in an Independent Fundamental Baptist Church and were left to sink or swim because they doubted or fell into sin and the memebers of their church didn't want to wade into the water and get wet to save them. They didn't want to get dirty to pull them out of the quicksand that they were in.

But Christ models this differently. He came and got dirty, and bloody. He left the 99 and sought the 1. Am I off base? Am I the only one who sees all the hurt souls that have been left to struggle while their church whistles "Amazing Grace". A song about grace, which is best defined as "receiving something we don't deserve". Isn't that what it's all about?

2000 Miles Later...

I am back from taking our teenagers on a college visit to Pensacola Christian College. Wow am I tired from all that driving... Oh and I hate teenagers. Good thing tomorrow is my day off because I am going to resign tomorrow. But I will Re-Sign up on Tuesday. Small spaces with your students really bring the Bible to life. You have to live what you preach and you (ok, at least me) don't always pass the tests. Many good decisions were made, some poor decisions were made (on my part and some students part), and God protected us as we traveled.